Jolyn Armstrong is a certified trauma recovery coach who helps people heal from trauma using dialectical behavioral therapy.
In this episode you will learn:
1. The difference between a trauma recovery coach and a psychiatrist or psychologist.
2. How to use dialectical behavioral therapy to help pull you out of any trauma you may have experienced.
3. What is the difference between mindfulness and distress tolerance?
“You get to determine how much suffering you will allow in your life. You get to determine the level of joy in your life. You have that power, no one else.”
Jolyn Armstrong is an author and certified trauma recovery coach. She helps people heal from trauma and build a great life after trauma, especially religious or secondary trauma.
Table of Contents
This is Jolyn Armstrong’s story…
As a Certified Trauma Recovery Coach, Jolyn’s unique ability to provide a safe space for connection and healing helps her clients find the peace that trauma has robbed from them. She teaches her clients to use Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (specifically Dialectical Behavior Therapy) and other proven techniques to overcome symptoms of trauma including toxic shame, grief, fear, and isolation to find peace and joy in life as they come through the healing process.
Jolyn’s family is her first priority in life. Nothing brings her more joy than spending time with her three adult sons and her amazing husband. It’s safe to say if Jack, Paul, John & Jim are involved, it’s going to be a great experience. Exploring new cities is a favorite pastime, especially if she has a loved one accompanying her. Jolyn loves bike riding with her friends and especially loves night bike rides around town with bikes all lit up and music playing. If you’re around Jolyn, you will probably be laughing at all of life’s absurdities.
In this episode, you will learn the following:
1. The difference between a trauma recovery coach and a psychiatrist or psychologist.
2. How to use dialectical behavioral therapy to help pull you out of any trauma you may have experienced.
3. What is the difference between mindfulness and distress tolerance?
Resources:
Subscribe on your favorite podcast player.
Schedule a free coaching call with Jolyn Armstrong at https://gvtraumarecovery.com/beyondtherut
Chapter Summaries:
[00:00:00] – This episode of Beyond the Rut is hosted by Jerry Dugan Dugan and features Joel, Jolyn Armstrong, and Joelyn, an author and certified trauma recovery coach. They discuss how to use dialectical behavioral therapy to help pull you out of any trauma you may have experienced.
[00:01:36] – Jo Lynn is a certified trauma recovery coach. She has written a book called Trauma Recovery the 90-Day Guidebook to Building a Great Life After Trauma. Jo Lynn recommends journaling to help people recover from trauma. She believes it’s a good first step for those who don’t want to seek help.
[00:07:03] – There is a powerful quote in the book “Post-trauma, Growth, and Healing” by Marsha Linehan that says you get to determine how much suffering you will allow in your life and the level of joy you will experience Marcia used the term “dialectical behavioral therapy” in her book DBT is a branch of cognitive behavioral therapy.
[00:09:48] – In DBT mindfulness, distress tolerance, emotion regulation, and interpersonal effectiveness are some of the skills that help people cope with stress. Today is a great day to start your own podcast. Sprout is the easiest and best way to launch, promote and track your podcast.
[00:12:39] – It takes a lot to restore confidence in people who have gone through trauma or abuse. It’s not just a women’s thing. Men listening to the show who have suffered trauma and gone through abuse are like, heck, yeah, that is how I feel. It takes a long time to recover from that.
[00:13:23] – Mindfulness is about focusing on the present moment and not worrying about the future. Gerry uses it to calm his team down when they are in a crisis. He also uses it when he is having a tense interaction with his employer. He finds it helpful in everyday life.
[00:19:53] – It takes some time for trauma survivors to reestablish their self-worth. Writing things out again is important for them to get back on track and to put their thoughts on paper again. “I’m not an awful person I’m not useless.
[00:20:21] – Mindfulness distress, tolerance, emotional regulation, and interpersonal effectiveness are the most important topics in the book by DBT. Expert people come to DBT when their lives are upside down and they feel like they are losing control. DBT includes a quiz at the beginning of the book and at the end of each kind of module.
[00:23:35] – Jolyn Jolyn Armstrong is a certified recovery trauma recovery coach. She chose this method over therapy because it allows her to connect with her clients on a more personal level. Joan has written a book called Trauma Recovery by Jolyn Jolyn Armstrong. Joan created a landing page for her website where people can find a copy of the book and get a copy for themselves.
[00:29:12] – Jerry Dugan and Jolene are happy to have Joel back on the show. Joel has some words of wisdom for those recovering from trauma. Jolene is glad to have Jerry Dugan back. They are going to stay in touch and get Jolene back on again.
[00:30:35] – Joel and I discuss the four modules within dialectical behavioral therapy and the benefits of healing from trauma. Joel suggests that you should get a copy of her book and try that 90-day challenge or find a professional like a trauma recovery coach or psychiatrist or psychologist or counselor.
Other episodes you’ll enjoy:
Achieving Your Best Life After Catastrophe with Jolyn Armstrong – BtR 318
Simon Harris on How to Leverage the Power of Emotions – BtR 302
Compassion Fatigue – When Their Trauma Becomes Your Trauma BtR 063
Connect with me:
Instagram: https://instagram.com/beyondtherut
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/beyondtherut
Twitter: https://twitter.com/beyondtherut
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jerrydugan/
Loved this episode? Leave us a review and rating here: on Apple Podcasts
Transcript
Jolyn Armstrong
If your life is feeling chaotic, and out of control, don’t dismiss the fact that you may be traumatized until you acknowledge that, hey, this may be what I’m dealing with, you can’t heal from it, so just be open to that. If things don’t feel right, they probably aren’t.
Jerry Dugan
Hey, Rutter nation. Welcome to another episode of Beyond the Rut, the podcast that shares encouraging stories and practical tools to help pull you out of your rut and into a life worth living. I’m your host, Jerry Dugan Dugan, and we’re going to be joined again by Joel and Jolyn Armstrong. She is an author and certified trauma recovery coach. And we’re going to be chatting about how to use dialectical behavioral therapy to help pull you out of any trauma you may have experienced in your life. And chances are, just as you heard in the introduction, if you are feeling overwhelmed in life, don’t discount the fact that there may in fact, be some trauma there that you need to deal with. We’re also going to talk about what’s the difference between a trauma recovery coach versus a psychiatrist or psychologist? And then how do you know which is the right for you? So sit back and relax, unless you’re being chased by aliens that are attracted to sound but can’t see for anything. In that case, find a family. They have this lady who’s got her cochlear implant is, like, on feedback loop and it will save the world. So maybe I watched a little bit too much of The Quiet Place, but that’s not important. Let’s listen to this conversation instead with Joelyn. Here we go. All right. Hey, Jo Lynn. Thanks for calling in from Colorado. How are you doing?
Jolyn Armstrong
I’m doing great, Jerry Dugan. Thank you. Thank you so much for having me again.
Jerry Dugan
Awesome. I know. Yes. We just aired your interview with us. I think it was like, episode 319. You talked about overcoming adversely, actually leveraging and coming out of life catastrophes, and you’ve been helping people do that since then. You’re now a certified trauma recovery coach. Now, folks don’t know we recorded that episode, like, late 2021, and it didn’t get to finally air until just a few weeks ago. And of course, this episode we’re recording now, now in September of 2022, and it probably won’t air for a few more months. So we’ve known each other for about a year by the time people hear this.
Jolyn Armstrong
Yes, we’re good old friends now.
Jerry Dugan
Yeah, we know each other’s kids and barbecues. Oh, man, that would be awesome. Yeah, I never turned out barbecue. But that’s not why we got you on since the last time we chatted and since and we reconnected when that episode aired a few weeks back, you’ve got a book that has come out now. It’s called Trauma Recovery the 90-day guidebook to building a great life after trauma. And so we’re talking about, like, that post trauma growth. We all in some way experience trauma whether it’s directly as the first person or secondary trauma, which I learned about when I was an educator with a battered women shelter, that you have secondary trauma where the family members who see it happening or the neighbors or anybody who witnesses it or knows someone who has gone through it, you’re experiencing that trauma as well. And we need a way to process that because if we process it, then we grow from it. We are able to help other people to go through it. And if we don’t, we wind up having these unhealthy behaviors that impact other people. We start lashing out at others. And I think I shared with you before we hit record, I probably see that happening kind of right now. And it’s like hurt people, hurt people. Well, it’s probably because they haven’t learned to heal from their trauma. So I guess I feel like I’ve just championed your book for you and I haven’t asked you a single question like, what is it you hope to help people achieve through the book Trauma Recovery?
Jolyn Armstrong
So I think and thank you for asking that question because this book really is a work from my heart, for sure. What I see with trauma survivors is a lot of one thing that’s really eroded is trust, especially trust in authority, trust in people who say, trust me, let me help you. Right? And so this book is a good first stepping stone for those people who say, listen, I’m not ready to seek out any kind of like, quote unquote, professional help. Let me just see what I can learn on my own. Let me see what I can do from the safety of my own home and maybe I can pick up some things here. This is also, just like the title says, it’s a 90 day guide. So there’s a lot of journal pages, ability to think through things, write things down. There’s something about pen to paper. So I provide a lot of opportunity in this.
Jerry Dugan
And generally I think it’s really great that you added so many journal pages to this because I’ve got, I think the most popular post on beyond the Rut.com is an article I wrote about why men should start a journal. And one of the reasons is it helps you take what is not tangible, which is a thought inside your head that it’s there and it goes. It’s there, then it goes. But the moment you take that thought and you write it down, you’ve now created something. It is now tangible. It is real. It is written word on paper or typed word on a computer and it’s real now. And you’ve now created with a thought just by journaling, right?
Jolyn Armstrong
It is. It’s an amazing process. And if you haven’t tried it yet, I would encourage anyone, traumatized or otherwise anyone, to give it a shot. You know nothing is going to hurt you, right? And what this one does to what I’ve provided in this guidebook is prompts. You know, I don’t know what to write. A lot of people tell me I can’t journal. I sit down to a blank piece of paper, I don’t know what to do. So I’ve included questions, I’ve included exercises, I’ve included options for people to write about through this process that are really geared towards trauma recovery.
Jerry Dugan
And you give them a variety of formats too. They could do a mind map. They can just write the words themselves. They can draw. So there’s no one way or right way to journal. It’s all about getting that thought out of your head on to something real. And I love that. I mean, I’ve done that years ago. I was just writing down some events that happened in my life and I remember crying after I had written. I’m like, wow, when I finished writing it, and I looked at a paragraph and I thought I went through that. Oh man. And I cried. I guess the good thing was I wake up before anybody else does in my family by hours. So by the time they woke up at nine, I already processed all this by 07:00 in the morning. There’s a lot of power in journaling. There’s this powerful quote in this book, so I’m going through it right now here, but I got a copy, you should get one. And I love you know, why are we talking about post trauma growth and healing and then thriving from trauma? And you got this quote in here that says you get to determine how much suffering you will allow in your life. You get to determine the level of joy in your life. You have that power, no one else.
Jolyn Armstrong
That’s right. We all in this world are going to experience suffering. We just are. But we do get to determine that that level of suffering, how much am I going to endure here? How much am I going to let this experience affect me and in what way? Right. One thing, one of the elements of trauma is having the lack of control of circumstances in our lives. And we all experience that. That is a thing that happens. We lose a job, we get a divorce. I want to maintain this thing that’s being taken from me and I don’t have control over that. But what we can control is our reaction to that and what we do with that uncontrolled circumstance.
Jolyn Armstrong
Yeah, unless somebody once pointed out to me like, we’re going to have an emotional reaction, we’re going to have that feeling on the inside. And what matters is turning that into a response. A response takes thought, it takes consideration, it takes reflection. And yes, we can definitely control how we respond. We may not control whether or not we feel upset in the moment, but how we respond from that huge, huge. And so there’s a phrase you use in your book called dialectical behavioral therapy. Now, I’m familiar with cognitive behavioral therapy because of where I used to work years and years and years ago. But what is dialectical behavioral therapy? And it has like four elements to it.
Jolyn Armstrong
Yeah, so this DBT is a big word for kind of a beautiful, simple process that is helpful in a lot of things. So it is a kind of a branch of cognitive behavioral therapy. It was developed by Marcia Linehan back in, I want to say the she initially developed it to help with her clients who had suicidal ideations, who were really struggling with that, and also who were struggling with mood disorders. And it now is really the gold standard in treating specifically those two things, but all of the things that those who are struggling with that experience so, you know, the fear and anxiety and all of those kinds of negative emotions. So, yeah, the four modules, I guess, in DBT, the first one that I always touch on with clients is mindfulness. If we can control to a certain extent our thoughts, that sets the stage for everything else. And that’s one thing that happens when we’re stressed, especially when we’re traumatized, is that spinning mind, right? I sit down to do something, I know I’ve got to, I’ve got to keep living my life. But I sit down, a thought enters my head and I start spinning and I’ve lost an hour or 2 hours or whatever, right. I try to go to sleep. I can’t sleep because my mind turns on. Mindfulness really helps with that. And so we use that on purpose for that reason, to help kind of control that. And another one is distress tolerance. So you think about the world we live in, all of the things that we encounter in our world. Distress tolerance is so helpful. So when we do encounter those really stressful, tense times, we have some skills on board to help us tolerate that and move forward. Emotion regulation is the third and that helps us to lessen the number of kind of really out of control situations that we have. Right. Some of the situations that we encounter when we’re stressed, we encounter or are made worse because we’re unable to really regulate our emotions. So that’s really helpful. More skills on board for that. And then the last bit is interpersonal effectiveness. So we talk about coming through trauma, healing from trauma. One thing that trauma does is it kind of strips us of our confidence and our ability to interact with others in a really meaningful way. And so we bring more skills on board to help with that as well.
Jerry Dugan
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Jolyn Armstrong
Oh, I love that. I love that. So mindfulness, it’s very simply put, is just choosing to focus our minds on this moment on purpose and without judgment, right? So when you think about, when you’re super stressed and you’re worried about the future if I do this thing, my world is going to cave in. If I do that thing or if this thing happens to me that I know could happen, then all of these things, you know, it’s the domino effect. And so that’s the opposite of mindfulness because we’re worrying about things in the future that may never even happen. And so we purposely bring ourselves back to the moment with some simple exercises. I can do one or two with you if you like that help us just focus on right now. And that’s really all we as a fire attraction by my house. Sorry about that. So focusing on just what is right now, what’s here and now. And it’s important for so many reasons to be able to do that. And a few of them I’ve mentioned, but others are, you know, when we’re in really stressful situations, let’s say maybe we’re at work and we’re having a really tense interaction with our employer, for example, being able to be mindful and just stay in this moment and interact with them in a mindful way rather than, oh my gosh, she said this. And it means all of these things. And getting your having a lack of ability to just stay right there in the moment and respond appropriately, it makes all the difference in the world when you can do that. So lots and lots of reasons that mindfulness. Although it’s kind of this woo woo kind of a thing, right? New agey thing, it actually has some concrete benefits in everyday life.
Jerry Dugan
I’ve thought about like, times I’ve been in a crisis, like a crisis moment, and everything seems to be hitting all at once. It’s like that movie, everything everywhere all at once, right? And it’s easy to become overwhelmed. And people have asked me, like, gerry, how do you handle a crisis like that? You always seem cool and collected. I’m like, well, that’s just my panic face looks the same as my calm, collected face. You just don’t know the difference, right? And so what I share with them is with my team is like what I’ll wind up doing is I take a deep breath and I look around the room and it’s like, okay, I’ve got all these things coming on, but what can I really work on right now? What is? And so I lay out the facts and I keep the story out of it in the moment, in the heat of the moment. And then it’s like, okay, from here, what is the most important thing to tackle here? The one thing. Because I can only do one thing. There’s too much going on. And then once I decided that one thing, then it’s like, great, then I could take action on the one thing. And what winds up happening is other people see me doing the one thing and they either A, jump in and help me, or B, they look around and they realize, oh, Jerry Dugan’s overlooked this thing over here. I’ll go take care of that to help him with the thing he’s doing over there. And then someone else will say, well, they’re doing this and they’re doing this. I could do this one thing, like without telling anybody anything. Folks start to spring into action and it’s all because you take that pause, deep breath. What is what’s the one thing I can do? Go do that one thing. And you got to be okay with letting everything else go, like it’s going to focus on the one thing, and then once things start to stabilize, you look up and say, oh, we forgot to lock the door over there, or, hey, did anybody call 911?
Jolyn Armstrong
The clarity that comes with focusing on one thing is amazing, difficult, and I’m sure that has served you in your life, Jerry Dugan, that ability that it seems kind of natural, probably for you. It’s not natural for everyone.
Jerry Dugan
No.
Jolyn Armstrong
So practicing that is super, super important.
Jerry Dugan
I heard ADHD helps a little bit.
Jolyn Armstrong
Yeah. Yeah. You’ve got more attention on that area, for sure.
Jerry Dugan
So, Mindfulness, it’s all about being in the moment right now, just looking at what is judging. Nothing. It’s not like it’s like, yes, the person said this. You’re removing the judgment from it. Well, they said it because I’m not worthy. They said it because I’m not pretty. I’m not smart, I’m not capable. And you’re just saying it’s what they stated.
Jolyn Armstrong
Those are the words that came out of their mouth. Yeah, got it. Right.
Jerry Dugan
And then I think it seems to also help if you state what is about you. I am a dignified person. If you are Christian, I’m a dignified creation. And so it’s like, I am this. I am educated. I am capable. A friend of mine said it’d be great what we could accomplish if we remove all the knots out of our lives. I’m not smart. I’m not capable. I’m not handsome, whatever.
Jolyn Armstrong
Yes.
Jerry Dugan
Then you’re left with the phrase of I am and very powerful.
Jolyn Armstrong
It is. It is. And what happens a lot of times when we talk about people, I look at things that cause trauma in our life, and a couple of them are different types of abuse. Either I’m in a cult or over that kind of a situation, or I’m in a narcissistic relationship. And all of those I am statements get ripped away. It’s the positive ones. Right. And you’re told all of these negative things, and those things are highlighted in your life. And so because that’s a really huge form of control, but you should be.
Jerry Dugan
Grateful you have a job here.
Jolyn Armstrong
Holy moly. I tell you. So just reestablishing that like, wait a minute. I’m not an awful person. I’m not useless. All of the things that trauma survivors have been told, it takes some time to rebuild that, and I’ll just throw that in. Writing things out again, acknowledging those things about yourself on paper, taking that thought, putting it on paper is really important.
Jerry Dugan
Yeah. Now, we mentioned when I say I mean you mentioned because you’re the expert who wrote the book dialectical Behavioral Therapy, DBT. We just talked about mindfulness, we probably don’t have time to go through all the remaining three distress tolerance, emotional regulation, and interpersonal effectiveness. But of those three, which one would you say stands out? They all, I’m sure, are equal value, equal weight. But what would be the next thing that somebody would want to consider if they’re trying to work through some things on their own.
Jolyn Armstrong
Do you know what that is going to be? I love that you ask this question. It’s going to be a little bit different for everyone depending on where they are in their recovery process. People who come to me oftentimes come to me when their life is upside down. Like I am completely losing control. And in that case, of course, Mindfulness, I say let’s start, everybody should start there and let’s get some of those practices down. But distress tolerance is super helpful if your life is upside down and you’ve got things coming at you. But one thing that I do include in this book is a little quiz at the beginning of the book and then at the end of each kind of module. And it’s kind of a roadmap for you or a mood assessment. If you’ve got the book in front of you. There’s one on page, I think two. So it helps you determine where do I go next? So you answer a few questions and score yourself. And based on your score, you turn to that next module in the book that addresses what kind of you’re dealing with.
Jerry Dugan
I love that. Yes, I saw that when I was previewing the book earlier. That is really cool.
Jolyn Armstrong
Yes, because sometimes you don’t know. All I know is that I feel like I’m in the middle of a hurricane, right. Everything is a mess. And one thing that happens, you may have seen this happen with people too, is when one thing goes wrong, a bunch of things wind up going wrong. It’s almost always a cascade effect and every part of your life gets touched and not in a good way. So it is really important to kind of have that guide to say, wait a minute, what do I even do first? What do I do?
Jerry Dugan
Yeah, I mean, it’s such a big deal to really look at the whole life, the big picture, because here at beyond the Right, we talk about faith, family, fitness, finances, and your outlook on future possibility because all those interconnect. And so like if you are worried about your finances, you might see that your emotional health is also taking a hit. Your family relationships are taking a hit. If you’re worried about your outlook on future growth and possibility, like, am I ever going to get promoted in this job? You’ll start to see the stress hit in other places as well. And if you’re just physically ailing in some way, that could put an impact on other things. And so, yeah, they all come together. I love that that’s discussed here in this book and covered and people get to work through it. Choosing between a certified recovery trauma recovery coach versus like a psychologist or psychiatrist or counselor, why would somebody choose a recovery coach would be the better option, right? Now.
Jolyn Armstrong
Yeah. So I think that that’s a really personal question, but it’s a good question because a lot of people don’t really know the difference or they’re unsure of the difference. So I chose coaching over therapy for a couple of reasons, specifically for trauma. And the main reason was the ability of a coach to connect on a real personal level versus a therapist is required to maintain a little bit of professional distance, right, and for lots of really great reasons. And it’s really important for therapists to do that, especially when working with people with real mental health illnesses. Trauma is an injury that happens. The injury happens both in your brain and your body. And a coach is able to come in, connect with you on a real way. I come in really as a peer. We learn from each other, we work together, I share my experiences, you share yours, and we’re really able to work through this together. It’s a completely different feel, and it’s uniquely beneficial in a trauma situation. The other reason that is just more on the business side is because I tend to move around a bit on my own. Licensure in America is, you know, in one state or group of states, and they can only work with people in that area. And I didn’t want to be kind of shoehorn into one place and limited as to who I can help.
Jerry Dugan
Yeah, that makes sense too, because now you’re not just limited to people in Colorado either. If you have somebody in New York City who needs to talk to you, they can reach out and get your help. And I think if I understand, the biggest difference between coaching and counseling also is coaching tends to be more future focused as well. Like, where are you going from here? What’s life going to look like now that you’ve gone through this? Whereas counselors also have the obligation to heal what happened to you in the past, like, hey, let’s walk you through and help you face what you’ve gone through. And so that’s also a big difference. Now, other times where you’re working with someone, you realize they do need a counselor and you make that recommendation as well.
Jolyn Armstrong
Absolutely. And a lot of times I will work hand in hand with a therapist, licensed therapist. So if a person has a mental illness or an issue that requires therapy, typically what will happen is if they have a therapist already, then I make sure that that therapist is comfortable working alongside a coach. If they are, then wonderful and we move forward. I help with the bits that I can help with, and, you know, the things that the therapist deals with, they handle as well, and we can work hand in hand that way. I have had times when I’ve had a therapist say, you know what? I’d rather not work alongside a coach right now. It’s not in the best interest of this client for this reason. And in that case, I will step back and say, listen, when you’re ready, come back to me. But get this worked out first. Work with this therapist first. So I have a deep respect for therapists and what they do and their education level and all of that. And I just think with Trauma Recovery specifically, I just love that coaching modality the ability to get closer.
Jerry Dugan
Yeah, nice. It’s a good important thing that we distinguish between the two and that you can have both. And then also to reassure folks, especially the counselors out there, are going to be like, hey, wait a second. Oh yeah, she’s helping us.
Jolyn Armstrong
Yeah, definitely. Well, and I turned to a therapist when I was initially hit with trauma, and I didn’t really know the difference then either. I didn’t realize I was traumatized. I go over that in the book a little bit. My therapist, really, and I mentioned her in this book. I still talk to her. I have really deep respect for her and she encouraged me to write this book actually, too. Yeah.
Jerry Dugan
Sometimes a little nervous about having a friend who is a therapist because it’s like, am I going to get a bill after this conversation? I thought we were just having coffee.
Jolyn Armstrong
Exactly. I don’t need therapy today. I just need you to listen.
Jerry Dugan
We’re just going to have lunch.
Jolyn Armstrong
Yeah.
Jerry Dugan
Chances are when we air this episode, the book is already out there. Trauma recovery by Jolyn Jolyn Armstrong. And so where can people find this book and get a copy for themselves and start working through this pages?
Jolyn Armstrong
Yeah, it’s available on Amazon, a few other places. What I would say is every place that’s available is listed on my website. And I did create a landing page just for your listeners. It has all of the information, ways to get in touch with me, some goodies for your listeners as well. That’s special for them. And that’s gvtramorecovery combeyondtherep. That’s us. Yeah, that’s you.
Jerry Dugan
Now, before we go though, Joel, what is a final word of wisdom you like to share with those who are recovering from trauma?
Jolyn Armstrong
I think, well, a couple of things I’d love to say. One is if your life is feeling chaotic, out of control, don’t dismiss the fact that you may be traumatized until you acknowledge that, hey, this may be what I’m dealing with. You can’t heal from it. So just be open to that. If things don’t feel right, they probably aren’t. And the other thing I want to say is that being traumatized does not make you less of a person. And it’s okay if we’re physically traumatized in a car accident or whatever. We don’t think less of ourselves. This is the same kind of a thing, right? Emotional trauma, it’s the real deal and it can happen to anyone and it’s okay and you can heal from it.
Jerry Dugan
Nice. Jolene, still great to have you on the. Show.
Jolyn Armstrong
Yeah. I’m so glad you’ll come back, Jerry Dugan. Thank you.
Jerry Dugan
Yes. Oh, man, I’m so glad you were on. We’re going to stay in touch, of course, and may be able to get you on here again and again and again. Especially people are reaching out to us and saying, I love that episode. Give us more. Oh, heck, yes. We’re going to do it. Thank you so much.
Jolyn Armstrong
Thanks, Jerry.
Jerry Dugan
All right. So you heard Joel in, and I have a conversation about the four modules within dialectical behavioral therapy, how it could help you if you are dealing with trauma that you need to heal from, the benefits of healing from trauma. And, you know, some things to think about. Maybe you get a copy of her book and try that 90 day challenge. Or maybe you got to find somebody who is more of a professional, like a behavioral coach. In this particular case, a trauma recovery coach like Jolin. Or you find a psychiatrist or a psychologist or a counselor to help you navigate those waters. Now, if you like everything you heard here in this episode, hit the share button and share this with your friends, your family members, and that coworker across the street. Or is it the neighbor across the street? It’s always been the neighbor across the street. Now you can find more information, like where do I get in touch with Joel, and where do I get a copy of this book? Where do I get this special download that she talked about? Well, go to the show [email protected] three, two, nine. And there you’ll find all those extras, the links to episodes that are similar to this one, that talked about recovery from trauma, mental health, those good things. Now, I’m glad you joined me this week, and I look forward to joining you again next week. But until next time, go live life beyond the rut. Take care.
